Over the next few weeks, I'm going to be using this blog to talk about the Conclave topics for this year, and what information they are going to be presenting to the player base to decide.
This week is the obten list. Like a lot of things in Vampire, and in the game, there's a group of players that only seem to process things in black and white, yes/no, and think that status, prestation, the unlife of a kindred should follow definite rules much like Aegis or Thaum.
The point of the Obten list was that it was supposed to be used as a deterrent for the majority, and more as a tactic to try and punish a kindred, that everyone knew was guilty and a threat but because STs and CMs think this is Perry Mason/Matlock by night, the PC keeps being allowed to get away.
People like to play the game as though loopholes in packets or the 'fluff' that make up most of the books are IC, and therefore even though everyone believes that PC Tim is the worst thing since Hitler, he keeps getting away. STs say 'he hasn't broken any rules', CMs say "bring it to council/the Coord didn't do their job" and players say "how come Tim gets to summon a demon in Elysium in front of the whole court and the Tremere say it's the Brujah's fault and nothing happens?"
So, look at the sheet, does it have Obtenebration? Who cares who they learned it from, who cares why, or how, or who told them too. It's on the sheet. We can talk to STs and weigh if this is a hardened player-killer who likes to flaunt the rules, or if this is a new/lowbie that's played in their local chronicle for years before getting national attention and they got shadowplay for some creepy cool IC reason.
Somewhere along the way, the having Obtenebration has become the crime, and not the intent or the reason for it. People have started to roleplay based on OOC information, that the list is a physical object with shadowy scribes in shadowy rooms indexing and double-checking and cross-checking and keeping meticulous records.
It's not. It's supposed to be vague, arbitrary and case by case.
The Obtenebration list and the relationship with the Lasombra AT are part of the agenda at conclave. My hope for the conclave is not that players see this as a chance to open the store on learning Obtenebration for the sake of winning the arms race.
For game play balance purposes, since OWbN has decided to use the Sixth Maelstrom, that the optional rules for unpredictable shadows are used. There's good IC plot hooks for that, and it wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility to suggest that Lasombra Abyss Mystics create and maintain a ritual that causes non Lasombra using Obten to have to use the optional rules and actual Lasombra are exempt.
From today until the conclave, my suggestion to the coords that have 'illegal obten' kindred in their custody hold onto them, depending on other crimes or suspicions of crimes, and at the conclave trot them out allowing them to defend themselves, and if the conclave decides that non-Lasombra are not allowed to have Obten, those kindred are to be killed immediately after the vote. Please don't whine about humanity.
If the list is decided to be ineffective and something else is needed, that will be addressed in the Shadow Coteries agenda item, which I will go into next week.
Friday, January 29, 2010
Tuesday, January 19, 2010
Happy New Year.
So, I intend, from this week, to try and make this weekly and keep to that goal.
I'm currently in the middle of the usual midwinter failout, which, mercifully, is all at the coord level and good manners prohibits me from sharing a lot of it here.
That said, observation 1: When I say "I don't know...x," I pretty much don't know it, and I'm asking so I can find out more. Who someone is, what the story is. I noticed that I'm pretty consistent in that speech pattern. As an aspiring poker player, now that I know that tell, I intend to try and stop it.
Observation 2 (tied to 1): When I ask a question that doesn't start with some variation of "I don't know...x", chances are, I already know the answer and want to see how much you are about to lie to me. If I say "Okay, so this thing you want to do, what book is it in?" you can safely fold knowing that I'm sitting on pocket kings and the other two just flopped to you showing of 6-7 off suit.
Observation 3: I've called you, I've shown you my hand. This is not the time for the debate. If I say "I've got 4 kings with an ace high," do not continue to argue with me saying that "but my 6 of clubs, 8 of spades, and the two kings on the table is just as good with the pinnacle rules from 1868 edition of Hoyles." I've stopped caring and definitely stopped reading. (This goes double if you're arguing something as a Coord or CM that directly affects your PC. Chances are I marked the email as read, moved on, and will only go back and read it later if I'm prepping a CM to propose your removal).
Observation 4: Clan Coords that say "I need an archon to clean up the midwest" I'm going to laugh at you. Seriously. I will laugh. Work together. If you don't have a tool in an area, and another coord has 4, talk to her. Work with her. Say "hey, I've heard about this situation, what can I do to help?" And then include the Sect Coord. So the sect coordinator can do his/her job. You're a clan coord. And that's great. Fix your clan, and your clans genre. Ignoring that to clean up the sect means you're doing a disservice to the other sects, a disservice to your clan, a disservice to the players and a disservice to the STs. Also, chances are you're worse at sect genre than the STs and Players you want to "fix." That arrogance and lack of regional political IC/OOC understanding is as responsible for all that is questionable in OWbN as anything Solon did as Shade.
So, I intend, from this week, to try and make this weekly and keep to that goal.
I'm currently in the middle of the usual midwinter failout, which, mercifully, is all at the coord level and good manners prohibits me from sharing a lot of it here.
That said, observation 1: When I say "I don't know...x," I pretty much don't know it, and I'm asking so I can find out more. Who someone is, what the story is. I noticed that I'm pretty consistent in that speech pattern. As an aspiring poker player, now that I know that tell, I intend to try and stop it.
Observation 2 (tied to 1): When I ask a question that doesn't start with some variation of "I don't know...x", chances are, I already know the answer and want to see how much you are about to lie to me. If I say "Okay, so this thing you want to do, what book is it in?" you can safely fold knowing that I'm sitting on pocket kings and the other two just flopped to you showing of 6-7 off suit.
Observation 3: I've called you, I've shown you my hand. This is not the time for the debate. If I say "I've got 4 kings with an ace high," do not continue to argue with me saying that "but my 6 of clubs, 8 of spades, and the two kings on the table is just as good with the pinnacle rules from 1868 edition of Hoyles." I've stopped caring and definitely stopped reading. (This goes double if you're arguing something as a Coord or CM that directly affects your PC. Chances are I marked the email as read, moved on, and will only go back and read it later if I'm prepping a CM to propose your removal).
Observation 4: Clan Coords that say "I need an archon to clean up the midwest" I'm going to laugh at you. Seriously. I will laugh. Work together. If you don't have a tool in an area, and another coord has 4, talk to her. Work with her. Say "hey, I've heard about this situation, what can I do to help?" And then include the Sect Coord. So the sect coordinator can do his/her job. You're a clan coord. And that's great. Fix your clan, and your clans genre. Ignoring that to clean up the sect means you're doing a disservice to the other sects, a disservice to your clan, a disservice to the players and a disservice to the STs. Also, chances are you're worse at sect genre than the STs and Players you want to "fix." That arrogance and lack of regional political IC/OOC understanding is as responsible for all that is questionable in OWbN as anything Solon did as Shade.
Friday, December 4, 2009
On Anarchs and the Camarilla
Q. How does the Camarilla at large view Anarchs.
A. I think in all but the extreme cases, it should be tolerance and patience. The Camarilla views the majority of anarchs as angry teenagers and figure that as long as they don't go crazed and cause too many problems, they can wait until the complexities of unlife force them to realize that while less than perfect, the Camarilla does offer the best possible solution.
The bad eggs may make it difficult for the Princes to see that, but the elders usually just sigh quietly and turn their eyes onto the Mortals and their web cams, KJ, Sabbat, Rupines, Independents, Giovanni, the falling US dollar and import to export trade deficit, the Bears in ability to run a defense and making sure that as long as LA is a "barony" they will never have a NFL team.
Q. What's a Bad Egg Anarch? Is that a named Coterie like the DMH or the Shadow Coterie
A. 1- Shadow Coterie is not the name of a coterie. It's a blanket term like "communists" or "liberals"
2 - A Bag Egg Anarch - most anarchs have to the good sense to stop short of random reckless violence (unlike many 6 status titled Kindred). I figure they can do what they want short of blowing things up.
Q. What happens if they blow things up?
A. They have no status. I am happy to have 5 anarchs killed to get to the 6th that actually did it.
A. I think in all but the extreme cases, it should be tolerance and patience. The Camarilla views the majority of anarchs as angry teenagers and figure that as long as they don't go crazed and cause too many problems, they can wait until the complexities of unlife force them to realize that while less than perfect, the Camarilla does offer the best possible solution.
The bad eggs may make it difficult for the Princes to see that, but the elders usually just sigh quietly and turn their eyes onto the Mortals and their web cams, KJ, Sabbat, Rupines, Independents, Giovanni, the falling US dollar and import to export trade deficit, the Bears in ability to run a defense and making sure that as long as LA is a "barony" they will never have a NFL team.
Q. What's a Bad Egg Anarch? Is that a named Coterie like the DMH or the Shadow Coterie
A. 1- Shadow Coterie is not the name of a coterie. It's a blanket term like "communists" or "liberals"
2 - A Bag Egg Anarch - most anarchs have to the good sense to stop short of random reckless violence (unlike many 6 status titled Kindred). I figure they can do what they want short of blowing things up.
Q. What happens if they blow things up?
A. They have no status. I am happy to have 5 anarchs killed to get to the 6th that actually did it.
Monday, November 23, 2009
To genre or not to genre, this is the question...
I wrote an article in portuguese about it and as I was too lazy to translate it, I would like to post a lesser piece of the thought.
In a few words: can we just do anything we want just using the magic words "it was ic" and "it was a PC's action"?
Can we accept the idea that only NPCs have to keep the genre? Is it ST's exclusive job to read the books, genre packets and all that stuff just to let a PC come and do it the other way, freely and without consequences?
Please, stay tuned.
In a few words: can we just do anything we want just using the magic words "it was ic" and "it was a PC's action"?
Can we accept the idea that only NPCs have to keep the genre? Is it ST's exclusive job to read the books, genre packets and all that stuff just to let a PC come and do it the other way, freely and without consequences?
Please, stay tuned.
Friday, November 6, 2009
Thursday, November 5, 2009
Humanity
In a short way:
1) Try not to loose it.
2) If you loose it, try not to make that obvious.
3) If it is obvious, try not to be mad when people who are scared from you want you to die.
4) Also, don´t be mad with the guys badder than you think you have talent so they want you to die before you become them.
5) Don´t be mad when people call you sabbat.
6) Don´t be mad if Sabbat still canlls you Camarilla.
Thanks,
1) Try not to loose it.
2) If you loose it, try not to make that obvious.
3) If it is obvious, try not to be mad when people who are scared from you want you to die.
4) Also, don´t be mad with the guys badder than you think you have talent so they want you to die before you become them.
5) Don´t be mad when people call you sabbat.
6) Don´t be mad if Sabbat still canlls you Camarilla.
Thanks,
Monday, October 19, 2009
there's not a lot of control
A lot of the criticism about coords (after the neopotism, poor handling, lack of encyolpedic historical knowledge), is the "Why don't the coords do something?" which is usually followed by the "how dare the coords do something!"
It's a difficult balance, and more often than not, it's responsible for coord burnout and players quitting.
When you know you can escape IC consequences by stonewalling OOC until the coord elections and hoping the other person wins, that's OWbN Genre.
It's a difficult balance, and more often than not, it's responsible for coord burnout and players quitting.
When you know you can escape IC consequences by stonewalling OOC until the coord elections and hoping the other person wins, that's OWbN Genre.
Friday, October 9, 2009
As we head to the elections...
You run the position like it should be run, not like a "I want to be nice to my friends." Instead of playing politics, you play Genre, which is what your job is.From an IM conversation.
No prop I write is designed to screw anyone. I realize those that do not want to believe that, will not.
There's a reason for a lot of what I do, and there's a reason the PC Archon bylaws are to be placed under "Accepting the Consequences" in the Character bylaws section.
It has always been my position, that characters should be held accountable for their actions, if people seem to think that means I want to punish people OOC for playing, that's depressing but not something I can fix.
All I can do is make sure people play the game, and that includes what happens when their naughty vampire gods get caught.
Thursday, October 1, 2009
State of Elysium 2009
While people like to make accusations that I don't know OWbN genre and or 'know the history', this is what is currently in the org on Elysiums:
From the book:
He's immune to being stripped for a breach of the Masquerade. It says nothing about Elysium. It also says he still needs to follow the Traditions.
OWbN Genre is genre that has been approved by council.
The 2007 OWbN Camarilla Status Packet:
From the book:
"The sheriff is immune to the powers of the keeper of Elysium (those conferred by the position, that is, he must still honor the Traditions)"
"The keeper may immediatly remove one permanent status trait from any kindred he catches breaking the Masaquerade. If he does not witness it himself, sufficient evidence must be brought forth. This removal costs the keeper nothing."
OWbN Genre is genre that has been approved by council.
The 2007 OWbN Camarilla Status Packet:
Keepers of Elysium may remove a Permanent Status Trait from any Kindred they catch breaking the Masquerade within their own city. This removal costs nothing. Many Princes also permit their Keepers to remove a Permanent Status Trait from any Kindred found to be in violation of Elysium, under the Tradition of Domain.
Sheriffs may remove one Permanent Status Trait from anyone who refuses to accompany them for questioning or judgment while they are within their own city. This removal costs nothing. Some Princes use their Sheriffs for additional duties, under the Tradition of Domain.
So, depending on the domain and Prince, the Prince may make the Keeper of Elysium responsible for handling breaches of Elysium.
BUT the "Sheriff" would still need to honor the Traditions and can't break them at will.
The 2003 Conclave:
Elysium is Elysium. Decided there by the players, ratified by council.
http://oneworldbynight.org/
Elysium is Elysium. It is more important than the Second Tradition or any of the traditions.
http://oneworldbynight.org/
Players decided this IC. It sticks IC.
Then there's the IC announcement form Igor Ctarinov
Citizens of the Camarilla,
Most recently, the Well-Known Prince Jack Sebastien stated:
"At the most recent Conclave that occurred in Northern Virginia, Justicar
Ctarinov mentioned that Archons doing their Feared duty may breach the
Traditions."
This was a statement made by His Enigmatic Excellency that, at the time, he felt was correct. However, if the Exalted Prince Jack Sebastien had taken the time to review the records of the Conclave, he would have noted the following:
---------------------------
2. Is the Second Tradition more important than the
Sanctity of Elysium?
Vote:
Yea - 38
Nay - 101
----------------------------
It was the will of the attending citizens of the Camarilla that Elysium is sacrosanct and therefore more important than the Second Tradition. His Enigmatic Excellency is not above the law, nor does he make law. He is merely the instrument that the Camarilla utilizes to enforce the law. Therefore, His Enigmatic Excellency and his Archons most wisely abide by the will of the Camarilla, justly ratified by the Inner Circle. Can the same be said for a Prince who willfully blocks the investigations of a Justicar and his duly appointed agents?
To accuse His Enigmatic Excellency of willfully violating Elysium would make him no better than your clanmate, Alexander Townsend. Said criminal did willfully violate the Elysium of Northern Virginia in the name of Her Fury, Justicar Masako. Now, as His Enigmatic Excellency's Sister-In-Service could not have possibly condoned such actions, I am sure that when Alexander Townsend is next seen, justice will be served.
Sincerely,
James
Servant to His Enigmatic Excellency
Justicar Igor Illyovich Ctarinov of Clan Nosferatu.
While I'm a big fan of Stephen Colbert, closing your eyes and ignoring facts you don't want to be true because it's not convenient is how we get bigger problems. This is OWbN Genre, and contrary to what a lot of people think, I care about OWbN Genre and will fight for it and not just ignore it because it's suddenly not fun.
Thursday, September 10, 2009
sorry for the spam. This is the last of going through my archives and posting the good bits
Selene: So... if Aetius is your fav Ventrue AT, and Dean is your favorite Lasombra, and Selene is your favorite Tremere AT
Selene: Who do we need to add to flesh out the pack?
CamCoord: Zio! as your pack priest.
Selene: Bah.
Selene: He's not worthy.
CamCoord: Look
CamCoord: It's not all stupid powers
CamCoord: Someone has to explain genre to you guys
CamCoord: and Zio! has sabbat genre DOWN
Selene: Until I monomancy him.
CamCoord: why?
CamCoord: he's your priest and you're vinc to him is huge
Selene: Dammit.
CamCoord: He talks about how fucking awesome you are in service to the sword of Caine
Selene: This Sabbat thing blowz.
CamCoord: He worships your dark aura of death
CamCoord: and appeases your ego as the ultimate thaumaturge killing machine
Selene: okay
Selene: well
Selene: maybe.
CamCoord: He hearlds your entry into each esbat with a confessional of your glories and triumphs.
CamCoord: Think Chaucer from A Knights Tale, if Chaucer was a blood drinking fiend celebrating the gifts that Caine has given all of you and signing while you make the blood flow
CamCoord: What the Cardinal of Baja and Alto California would do with such strong swords
Selene: Ok. Maybe it doesn't suck too bad.
CamCoord: Like I said, it's the roleplay part. Leave that to us. ;)
The Sabbat is really easy to play, harder to play well. The Camarilla is harder to play, but honestly, once you get the basics, it's very easy to play. And no, Camarilla does not mean playing the biggest bastard out there with out care of feelings. The point of the Camarilla is the struggle to hold on to your humanity, if you're playing like you're a sociopathic monster killing by proxy you are doing it wrong.
The Camarilla game, death is cheating, killing your opponent robs you of an opponent. Robs you of your Joker or Sherlocke Holmes. Sure it's satisfying and some concepts in OWbN just need killing, but that should be the players choice or the ST's input. Not necessarily through PVP violence.
The concept of "Face" is part of what Camarilla society is based on. How you are seen, how others treat you, that's the important thing. Losing Face is death, and being an unstoppable killing machine is not Face. Being able to say "my sheet is bigger than yours" is not Face. Saying I don't care is not a luxury, because then you've allowed yourself to lose Face and you'll be tainted and when it is something you care about, you'll be alone with no friends because no one likes hanging out with that guy, and that's the problem with the Camarilla. You need to hang out with people, or you become the crazy hermit that needs to be put down.
Learn to use Face. Learn that being in the Camarilla means caring about how others see you. Learn that monsters on paths that show off how cool they are for being on a path is the Sabbat, not Camarilla and in the Camarilla, you may be forced to smile at them in a court, but you're not going to make them your facebook friend.
Dale loves this post.
Larry the Bruce - something about WoD and traits or something.
Me - WoD is not OWbN Genre.
Some ST named Jordan - "Are you serious? I know OWbN moved away from the books but should we get rid of WoD and make it some disney happy fun land?" His email is 10 times longer than mine. Mine was 5 words. His "OMG THINK OF THE GENRES!" was about 50.
Seriously.
A five word sentence gets me into trouble on the ST list (council I can do it in 3.)
My response -
The point I'm making is that OWbN genre gets used a lot on Council and ST lists. And that would be fine, but those same people like to turn around and defend their actions with WW genre, sometimes in the same breath. It gets annoying. We're playing a homebrew setting created by the power gamers that haven't quite yet and want to re-write the game to suit them, unless that's suddenly being used to get them, in which case it's "oh, well, the books say this is okay..."
It's become clear that a lot of the genre fail in the org is at the ST level and they're willingness to hand out cookies but never bother to explain to their players the game they are playing.
And again, this isn't a burnout rant, I'm not there yet, but sometimes I wish these people would rather explore why they play and what they want out of a LARP rather than spend so much energy on an email over 5 words.
Me - WoD is not OWbN Genre.
Some ST named Jordan - "Are you serious? I know OWbN moved away from the books but should we get rid of WoD and make it some disney happy fun land?" His email is 10 times longer than mine. Mine was 5 words. His "OMG THINK OF THE GENRES!" was about 50.
Seriously.
A five word sentence gets me into trouble on the ST list (council I can do it in 3.)
My response -
Are you new?I recognize that not all get my humor, and that over email, it's harder, but really, it's starting to look like they're not even trying. They take themselves, the org, their PCs so seriously to psychotic levels that they can't deal with anything that might cause them to think or laugh at themselves.
I'm not trying to be mean, I just need to figure out how much of a 5 word sentence I need to explain.
Players quit rather than roleplay out the consequences of their PCs actions. STs say "omg, no one could have found out that secret" despte the player with the secret running around and telling it to everyone.
WoD - You're a shitty vampire, low on the totem pole, scared of the dark and the knowledge that for as cool as you are being a filthy bloodsucker leeching on humanity, there is always something bigger, faster, nastier than you.
OWbN - "Let's have PC Justicars."
Council says that Coords should have to get everything they want to do approved by them. STs allow Trevor Wallace, the Prince/Archbishop/Setite Pontiff of Oakland who had his true name changed through a Setite ritual to avoid being discovered as a Path of Mars cracked out Brujah.
The Camarilla in OWbN is a violent, militant, xenphobic organization that promotes Paths of Enlightenment, getting Thaum to win, and that you don't need an accounting or to care about the Sect and it's rules as long as you can kill anything that has a splat book.
I am definitely not saying that OWbN is a disney theme park with desperate college students in costumes trying to keep the kids happy, wait.. .maybe I am if by kids you mean players with entitlement issues and juvenile power fantasies and costumes you mean STs.
Alan
Cam Coord
The point I'm making is that OWbN genre gets used a lot on Council and ST lists. And that would be fine, but those same people like to turn around and defend their actions with WW genre, sometimes in the same breath. It gets annoying. We're playing a homebrew setting created by the power gamers that haven't quite yet and want to re-write the game to suit them, unless that's suddenly being used to get them, in which case it's "oh, well, the books say this is okay..."
It's become clear that a lot of the genre fail in the org is at the ST level and they're willingness to hand out cookies but never bother to explain to their players the game they are playing.
And again, this isn't a burnout rant, I'm not there yet, but sometimes I wish these people would rather explore why they play and what they want out of a LARP rather than spend so much energy on an email over 5 words.
Monday, July 20, 2009
My thoughts on R&U
It's a touchy subject. It was trying to make the best possible decision for an organization that was growing as fast as the internet would allow it.
It is likely one of the most divisive elements in the org because it tells players that they can't play their special snowflake, and the only reason is because the coords are a pox on fun.
It is the R&U List.
This is my idea, based on a suggestion by Mike Lehman on the council list. It is only a suggestion, but I would happily support it as a proposal.
Instead of a long and rambling list that's added too piece by piece, we encourage players to focus more on their concept and their PC and less of the cool powerz/cool clanz.
We create a list depending on genre/splat book and say "This is what is acceptable to play."
Cam genre chronicle uses this list, sabbat genre chronicle uses this list, Changing Breeds game uses this list, Anarch, this list, KJ, this list so on.
If you want to be 'special' it's a vote on council. Included on the list are reasons why certain clans/bloodlines/disciplines/merits/
If you want to use an NPC, it's notify to the coords. The Coords work with the Storytellers on it, and if one game in South Carolina has a traveling Brujah pretending to be a Ventrue, and a game in North Dakota wants to run a similar plot, then the Coord can coordinate that, and create a little consistency between games.
NPCs would be notify to Coords. STs would be asked to include why they feel they need to use the NPC, how long they plan to use the NPC, and what the NPC will teach their players.
Coords approve the NPC use, most of it would just be bookkeeping and ideally it would be idea sharing. What one game wants to do with a Nagaraga antagonist might work in another game that's asking for some plot ideas.
If the coord says no, it's a vote, and to accomodate games, we can have two levels, one which is the standard policy and the one which is a provisional one-week vote, which would limit the amount the game could do with the NPC, but would allow it to be played if the vote passes.
This would encourage STs to work with the coords on making sure it fits in the shared World of OWbN, and if STs feel that the coords are being too picky, they can take it to council.
This would include demons and demon plots, genre breakers like sect innappropriate paths, and assist in creating a census so that when someone says it's not fair that they can't play an Abomination Hedgemage embraced by a Gargoyle, we can list the reason that there are only supposed to be -1 of those in existence and OWbN has 3, and they need to wait their turn.
It is likely one of the most divisive elements in the org because it tells players that they can't play their special snowflake, and the only reason is because the coords are a pox on fun.
It is the R&U List.
This is my idea, based on a suggestion by Mike Lehman on the council list. It is only a suggestion, but I would happily support it as a proposal.
Instead of a long and rambling list that's added too piece by piece, we encourage players to focus more on their concept and their PC and less of the cool powerz/cool clanz.
We create a list depending on genre/splat book and say "This is what is acceptable to play."
Cam genre chronicle uses this list, sabbat genre chronicle uses this list, Changing Breeds game uses this list, Anarch, this list, KJ, this list so on.
If you want to be 'special' it's a vote on council. Included on the list are reasons why certain clans/bloodlines/disciplines/merits/
If you want to use an NPC, it's notify to the coords. The Coords work with the Storytellers on it, and if one game in South Carolina has a traveling Brujah pretending to be a Ventrue, and a game in North Dakota wants to run a similar plot, then the Coord can coordinate that, and create a little consistency between games.
NPCs would be notify to Coords. STs would be asked to include why they feel they need to use the NPC, how long they plan to use the NPC, and what the NPC will teach their players.
Coords approve the NPC use, most of it would just be bookkeeping and ideally it would be idea sharing. What one game wants to do with a Nagaraga antagonist might work in another game that's asking for some plot ideas.
If the coord says no, it's a vote, and to accomodate games, we can have two levels, one which is the standard policy and the one which is a provisional one-week vote, which would limit the amount the game could do with the NPC, but would allow it to be played if the vote passes.
This would encourage STs to work with the coords on making sure it fits in the shared World of OWbN, and if STs feel that the coords are being too picky, they can take it to council.
This would include demons and demon plots, genre breakers like sect innappropriate paths, and assist in creating a census so that when someone says it's not fair that they can't play an Abomination Hedgemage embraced by a Gargoyle, we can list the reason that there are only supposed to be -1 of those in existence and OWbN has 3, and they need to wait their turn.
Wednesday, July 15, 2009
The Red List
Do not view this as a shopping list.'Saying "I want my PC to hunt someone on this list, how do I find out who is on it" will likely lead to an unsatisfying and disappointing conclusion of death, or your PC spends x years chasing his own shadow and finds nothing.
Getting on the Red List IC requires one Justicar to say "this person is bad, and I can't deal with it alone," followed by a second Justicar verifying it, and then a unanimous decision from the rest of the Justicars. The Red List can either be the worst of the worst or some poor bastard that said he hated Petronius' book and woke up one evening to find his friends dead and everyone hunting him.Getting on the Red List OOC is detailed in Section 13 of the Character regulation bylaws.
There are no PC Red Listers.There are no PC Alastors.
There is no being released from being an Alastor service except for sweet sweet death.The WW Canon Red Listers are taken from the Kindred Most Wanted, published by White Wolf. Some details and stats may change.
(Names listed in no particular order)- Rabbat
- Enkidu
- Ossian
- Dylan
- Ferox
- Danya/Alexis
- Germaine
- Petaniqua
- Kemintiri
- Jack the Barber*
- ** Open Slot, not yet publically announced
- ** Open Slot, not yet publically announced
- ** Open Slot, not yet publically announced
Those who have been successfully hunted:
- Tariq - killed by Mme. Guil (she was executed for diablerizing Tariq)
- Valarius Maior - killed by Victor Schultz
- Gabriel Camaratta* - killed by Karsh
- Genina - killed by Lucinde
- Angelo - killed by Johnny Moto
* (OWbN PC)
Tuesday, May 19, 2009
From the Player of Daniel Book.
So I figured I would drop you my current pet rant about the Camarilla, maybe for the blog.
The Camarilla, by its own reckoning, is the scale that all vampires are weighed on.
On the one side are the humane, the civil, the composed and the graceful. On the other are the monsters, inhumane, Masquerade breakers, tradition breakers and heretics.
The Camarilla represents neither side of the scale, but the scale itself.
The battle the elders have tasked their creation with is not one of Camarilla vs Sabbat or Coterie Vs. Pack, but one of Man against the Beast, humane vs inhumane.
Every kindred that shouts out that they have discarded humanity to defend the Camarilla is in fact yelling, "I have lost the battle and am tearing down that which I am sworn to defend." Noble warriors who refuse to fall to their beast are to be revered for their sacrifice and their struggle, those who give in to their beast and foreswear Humanity should be maligned and ostracized. While these monstrous assassins are arguably needed in every war even Kindred society should never be comfortable in making or using them. Standing next to a man who killed women and children in their sleep to "protect his country" should make anyone uncomfortable. Kindred on paths represent these unfortunate few who sold their souls, sometimes under orders, to do what was "needed".
~Seth
Friday, April 24, 2009
Allow me this moment of Snark
"OMG, Coords have totally killed six or four or a handful of PCs! Including mine! But that's not what I'm complaining about!"
Consequences suck. Too often it feels like an episode of COPS where the guy is in the back of the car after having been found after driving his car into a telephone pole, with the crack pipe, suspended drivers license, warrant out for his arrest, possession of a firearm, and screaming how unfair it is.
See my post about the accounting and Truth. It's not don't get caught, you know you're not supposed to be doing what your doing. Trying to pretend to be ignorant later just makes you look worse. Complaining OOC just makes you look like you don't know how to play the game.
Consequences suck. Too often it feels like an episode of COPS where the guy is in the back of the car after having been found after driving his car into a telephone pole, with the crack pipe, suspended drivers license, warrant out for his arrest, possession of a firearm, and screaming how unfair it is.
See my post about the accounting and Truth. It's not don't get caught, you know you're not supposed to be doing what your doing. Trying to pretend to be ignorant later just makes you look worse. Complaining OOC just makes you look like you don't know how to play the game.
The Accouting
What I'd love to see is more emphasis on the Accounting. One of the things that really struck me in the first edition, was the line that the Accounting was an average of 10 years, and that most players should play characters that had just been released from the Accounting.
Now, I don't read a lot of backgrounds. I don't read a lot of fan fic or slash fic either.
When I do, I'm struck at how the Accounting is always missing, or its one line, or just misses the point.
The Accounting is the second most important of the Traditions. I'd allow an argument that Progeny would be second, but it's a close race, any moron can be turned into a Vampire, but to be a Kindred and Acknowledged, you need to prove that you're worth it, but more than worth it, you need to prove you get it.
The Camarilla is a successful conspiracy. Whether you believe it or not, and with enough White Wolf Lore, you likely don't, but the point is the conspiracy only works if people have bought into to it. And that's what The Accounting is all about. There's a reason why the Mods for the Yahoo Cam Group ask which Prince Acknowledged your PC. It's because that's when you first became your own kindred. Part of any social interaction is the rite of passage, and that should be your PCs. Backgrounds should not be about the time you met Caine or fought Hardestadt to a standstill in a battle of wits. It should be your life before your embrace, the embrace and then focus on the years afterward up to the point when you were released, and that next night should be your first game.
Now, I don't read a lot of backgrounds. I don't read a lot of fan fic or slash fic either.
When I do, I'm struck at how the Accounting is always missing, or its one line, or just misses the point.
The Accounting is the second most important of the Traditions. I'd allow an argument that Progeny would be second, but it's a close race, any moron can be turned into a Vampire, but to be a Kindred and Acknowledged, you need to prove that you're worth it, but more than worth it, you need to prove you get it.
The Camarilla is a successful conspiracy. Whether you believe it or not, and with enough White Wolf Lore, you likely don't, but the point is the conspiracy only works if people have bought into to it. And that's what The Accounting is all about. There's a reason why the Mods for the Yahoo Cam Group ask which Prince Acknowledged your PC. It's because that's when you first became your own kindred. Part of any social interaction is the rite of passage, and that should be your PCs. Backgrounds should not be about the time you met Caine or fought Hardestadt to a standstill in a battle of wits. It should be your life before your embrace, the embrace and then focus on the years afterward up to the point when you were released, and that next night should be your first game.
OWbN Wide Plots
There's been talk on the Council list about the KJ Plot that OWbN ran a few years back, which I said we should learn from and was asked what specifically.
The lesson I think that was learned, or should be taken, is that meta plots in the One World By Night is that they should be flexible enough that no member chronicle feels they need to follow a rigid script and can put their own unique spins on it, and that players can feel they contribute to it and can make it personal to them, and don't need to get involved in online scenes or special event games where it's focused solely on a handful of players. At the same time, it should contain enough details so that it's consistent acorss the board and a player who goes to one game and is told "omg! Seatlle got destroyed!" doesn't go to another game and get told "Seattle beat back the sabbat and won!"
So, for an OWbN meta plot, it needs to be open so that if one game wants a Michael Bay style rain of fire, volcanoes and gun-fu, it can, and another game can run My Dinner with Andre with talking and scenes in a library with warmed crystal goblets filled with blood, and a third can run a cloak and dagger CSI/24 game ("There's NO TIME Madame Justicar!"), and from that, the coordinators running it, can see where it's going and try and create bookends based on involvement.
It's similar to the way WW runs V:TES storylines, but I think that's the best possible solution for OWbN over a MMO style "here's this weekend where we'll run scripted events and then it'll end!" or taking a TT game and moving around and telling other players "oh, no, it's changed." We're in OWbN because we're not Cam Inc, and we don't have global storytellers and mandated plots, we let the Chronicles (which is Players and STs) make up the story. If there is to be a meta-plot, it should be a plot line that is shared across the board that is open and yet guided.
The lesson I think that was learned, or should be taken, is that meta plots in the One World By Night is that they should be flexible enough that no member chronicle feels they need to follow a rigid script and can put their own unique spins on it, and that players can feel they contribute to it and can make it personal to them, and don't need to get involved in online scenes or special event games where it's focused solely on a handful of players. At the same time, it should contain enough details so that it's consistent acorss the board and a player who goes to one game and is told "omg! Seatlle got destroyed!" doesn't go to another game and get told "Seattle beat back the sabbat and won!"
So, for an OWbN meta plot, it needs to be open so that if one game wants a Michael Bay style rain of fire, volcanoes and gun-fu, it can, and another game can run My Dinner with Andre with talking and scenes in a library with warmed crystal goblets filled with blood, and a third can run a cloak and dagger CSI/24 game ("There's NO TIME Madame Justicar!"), and from that, the coordinators running it, can see where it's going and try and create bookends based on involvement.
It's similar to the way WW runs V:TES storylines, but I think that's the best possible solution for OWbN over a MMO style "here's this weekend where we'll run scripted events and then it'll end!" or taking a TT game and moving around and telling other players "oh, no, it's changed." We're in OWbN because we're not Cam Inc, and we don't have global storytellers and mandated plots, we let the Chronicles (which is Players and STs) make up the story. If there is to be a meta-plot, it should be a plot line that is shared across the board that is open and yet guided.
Thursday, April 9, 2009
Truth in the Camarilla
As I head off to a judicial conclave in Vegas this weekend, there is something that needs to be stressed.
The first thing, Genre Wise, and I'll be making this statement to the Council and ST list, is that it's not Law & Order: Camarilla.
I don't care about facts, and truth and "What really happened OOC." Status and Prestation work on perception and image, not whining out of character about what happened. I have a t-shirt that's in the wash that says "I didn't say it was your fault, I said I'm going to blame you," and as the player of Daniel Book, Seth Yokely says "I dont care what you did, I care what they said you did". That's the nature of truth in the Camarilla. If you really did it, well then, that just makes it easier. If you didn't, you better make a compelling argument and be well liked. It is high school, it is every clique social circle, it is Heather's and that petition you signed that you thought was for banning all the Caitiff was in fact for blowing up the school.
So, "Truth"? "What really happened?", it's what I say happened. It's what people believe happened, and it's what is perceived to have happened. If something is said IC and you know it's wrong OOC, don't whine about it. Deal with it IC. If something happens IC and you're confused as to why, then don't whine about it OOC, ask IC. That's called Roleplay.
The anything goes mentality of the kindred of the Camarilla is not: random killing, learning the wrong disciplines, instant conversions between sects; it's playing diplomacy with people you've been friends with for years and laughing at them as you stab them in the back knowing they can't do anything about it. That's what the books talk about, making your friends look and smell bad while you get ahead, while knowing that down the line, they'll remember what you did and will be willing to do the same to you, so you better make sure that's the reputation that you want. Oh, and if you kill them? Means that no one is going to want to be friends with you, and you can't take the Ukraine with out friends.
So get "Truth" out of your head. Truth is whatever the Elders of the Sect say is the truth. People believe what the want to believe and Cam Lore 5 should tell you that there's always something more going on behind the scenes, and maybe it's a bad idea to always demand to pull back the curtain to see.
The first thing, Genre Wise, and I'll be making this statement to the Council and ST list, is that it's not Law & Order: Camarilla.
I don't care about facts, and truth and "What really happened OOC." Status and Prestation work on perception and image, not whining out of character about what happened. I have a t-shirt that's in the wash that says "I didn't say it was your fault, I said I'm going to blame you," and as the player of Daniel Book, Seth Yokely says "I dont care what you did, I care what they said you did". That's the nature of truth in the Camarilla. If you really did it, well then, that just makes it easier. If you didn't, you better make a compelling argument and be well liked. It is high school, it is every clique social circle, it is Heather's and that petition you signed that you thought was for banning all the Caitiff was in fact for blowing up the school.
So, "Truth"? "What really happened?", it's what I say happened. It's what people believe happened, and it's what is perceived to have happened. If something is said IC and you know it's wrong OOC, don't whine about it. Deal with it IC. If something happens IC and you're confused as to why, then don't whine about it OOC, ask IC. That's called Roleplay.
The anything goes mentality of the kindred of the Camarilla is not: random killing, learning the wrong disciplines, instant conversions between sects; it's playing diplomacy with people you've been friends with for years and laughing at them as you stab them in the back knowing they can't do anything about it. That's what the books talk about, making your friends look and smell bad while you get ahead, while knowing that down the line, they'll remember what you did and will be willing to do the same to you, so you better make sure that's the reputation that you want. Oh, and if you kill them? Means that no one is going to want to be friends with you, and you can't take the Ukraine with out friends.
So get "Truth" out of your head. Truth is whatever the Elders of the Sect say is the truth. People believe what the want to believe and Cam Lore 5 should tell you that there's always something more going on behind the scenes, and maybe it's a bad idea to always demand to pull back the curtain to see.
Thursday, March 26, 2009
Crime in the Camarilla
The thing about the 7th tradition (for those just joining the org, it's "Don't get caught") is that it's a fallacy. It doesn't matter if you get caught or not, you know you're doing something wrong, and therefore it's still a crime.
My list of crimes so far - and this is not a comprehensive list, there will be changes made to the list including additions and clarifications.
Breaching the Traditions.
Breaching the Traditions and using coercion and threats to make it "okay."
Breaching the Traditions and saying it was for the good of the Sect.
Knowing Vicissitude.
Teaching Vicissitude.
Joining a coterie for the purpose of learning Vicissitude.
Flagrant use of Vicissitude in public.
Knowing Obtenebration.
Teaching Obtenebration.
Joining a coterie for the purpose of learning Obtenebration.
Flagrant use of Obtenebration in public.
Removing hearts to ensure loyalty to the coterie above the sect.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange disciplines.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange information.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange phone numbers.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange disciplines.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange information.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange phone numbers.
Consorting with the Followers of Set to allow the Setites to corrupt the sect.
Force embracing and then using that embrace to teach disciplines.
Forced embracing for the purpose of diablerie
Kicking puppies
Drowning rabbits
Supporting stem cell research
Smoking
My list of crimes so far - and this is not a comprehensive list, there will be changes made to the list including additions and clarifications.
Breaching the Traditions.
Breaching the Traditions and using coercion and threats to make it "okay."
Breaching the Traditions and saying it was for the good of the Sect.
Knowing Vicissitude.
Teaching Vicissitude.
Joining a coterie for the purpose of learning Vicissitude.
Flagrant use of Vicissitude in public.
Knowing Obtenebration.
Teaching Obtenebration.
Joining a coterie for the purpose of learning Obtenebration.
Flagrant use of Obtenebration in public.
Removing hearts to ensure loyalty to the coterie above the sect.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange disciplines.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange information.
Consorting with the Sabbat to exchange phone numbers.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange disciplines.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange information.
Consorting with the Giovanni to exchange phone numbers.
Consorting with the Followers of Set to allow the Setites to corrupt the sect.
Force embracing and then using that embrace to teach disciplines.
Forced embracing for the purpose of diablerie
Kicking puppies
Drowning rabbits
Supporting stem cell research
Smoking
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